Fat Joe Reflects on His Time With Big Pun, Losing the Grammy to Chance the Rapper and His Lost Jay-Z Collab

In the book, you detail seeing Pun being administered CPR by paramedics. The year before that, you and Cam’ron saw New York rapper Big L lifeless on the street after being shot in Harlem. How do you get through moments when you literally see lives lost?

I’ve dealt with a lot of death. I grew up with 40 guys, and 35 of them got killed. That shit is draining, bro. And so when you talk about Big Pun … that was devastating. It destroyed my world. I don’t even know how to explain it to you. So here we are, we brothers, we’re flying high, we get rich together. We made it! [It’s 1998], he’s going platinum with Capital Punishment. First Latino double-platinum rap album.

His first great success is your biggest success, at the same damn time.

Yeah—I discovered him, so in that sense. I was the Puff Daddy, he was the Biggie. And to just have that all just go away at such a young age, I didn’t know how to deal. So that’s when I went into depression. Now Big L’s another thing, a lot of these kings, Biggie, Big L. A lot of these guys got murdered for stuff they didn’t really have to get murdered over. They didn’t deserve it. Not that anybody deserves it, but these guys are sweet guys. Those guys were beautiful guys.

Back to Big L. Your support system, at least in hip hop, was the Diggin’ in the Crates Crew that you were both members of. The book includes stuff about you trying to make it in music while still dealing in the streets.

First of all, I loved being a drug dealer. Sad to say, right? I loved the power that came with it. The money came with it. I’ve been a wild kid my whole life. I woke up every day for violence. That was my thing. Waking up to get it poppin’. Never a dull day.

The only positive thing happening was that kids I grew up with—Showbiz, Diamond D, Lord Finesse—they all started blowing up in music. So I finally saw a way out. I had to see Lord Finesse get a record deal. I had to see Diamond D shoot a video. This is possible. I can do this. Nothing was given to me: I went to Showtime at the Apollo. Imagine, I went to Amateur Night to get discovered, even though I grew up with the Diggin’ in the Crates Crew. But that just lets you know my DNA, and my determination to be successful.

“Lean Back” exploded in 2004. Multi-platinum. The dance took over the summer. The remix extended everything even further. Lil Jon was hot as fish grease and you added his touch. You brought Mase back to hip hop, and even Eminem jumped on the record. When you make a record that successful, what comes with that?

Nothing but beautiful things. You’re making all kinds of money. You’re Number 1 in the world. Your dick can’t be no bigger. You’re walking out, every car’s playing your song. You’re on fire. Your crew feels good. Your wife is walking big. Number One—it’s a different type of drug, a different type of high. I tell young artists all the time, I’d rather be a one-hit wonder than to be a no-hit nothing. There’s nothing like having an anthem so impactful that Bruce Willis is leaning back. Now, the bad part that comes with that is, you’re as good as your last hit. I came back with “Make It Rain,” which went platinum. But it wasn’t “Lean Back.” And even years later, when I came with “All the Way Up” in 2016, it still wasn’t the phenomenon of “Lean Back.”